I was disappointed in the Stars in general and the captain in particular that there were no hard hits on Darnell Nurse. No retribution whatsoever for his slash on Roope. Unbelievable.
It's a different game than it used to be, for sure. They're focused on winning, and chasing around a player and getting a major penalty for retaliation (and/or a suspension) isn't something they're looking to do, apparently.
Yes, Stars didn’t get the breaks, but as you say, they need to make their own breaks. Odd man rushes a function of pressing for offence when behind. I also wish Stars would have extracted ‘a bit’ of retribution for the Nurse infraction.
It's pretty simple. Edmonton is better. And it's not disputable in any way.
They're bigger.
They're stronger.
They're faster.
They're more skilled.
They're more physical.
And, for the 2nd time in two years, they've received the better goaltending.
There's not a single area where Dallas hasn't been outplayed by a substantial margin.
Consider these numbers:
Since game 4 of the 2024 WCF Edmonton has won 5 of six games and outscored Dallas 21-11. That's an avg score of 3.5 to 1.8. The Stars have scored 1 or fewer goals in 4 of those six games. Pretty hard to win when you never score more than a goal.
Further, getting exposed in the WCF is just what this iteration of the Dallas Stars does. They've played 15 WCF Finals games since 2023; they are 5-10 in those games and have been outscored 48 to 35. And the numbers get worse the further you go into a series:
Game 1: Stars have outscored opponents 11-10 (Positive!)
Game: 2: Stars have been outscored 7-5
Game 3: Stars have outscored opponents 10-8
So games 1-3 Dallas is even at 26-26. However, from games 4 through 6 Dallas has been outscored 22-9.
Game 4: Stars outscored 7-5
Game 5: Stars outscored 7-3
Game 6: Stars outscored 8-1
I would argue that by game 5 of each of these series it was clearly established that Vegas and Edmonton had objectively better teams than the Stars.
And that feeling is moreso in 2025. Outside of those fluky 5 minutes when Edmonton lost their mind and took a trio of penalties the Stars have been outscored 12-1.
Literally no one is playing at the hoped for level. Huge parts of the roster have continued their highly disappointing post-season play. The biggest issue is no one can score. The Stars had an 11.8% goal percentage on shots on net in the regular season - a full 1.1 points higher than the league average. Consider the following players shooting pct in playoffs:
Jason Robertson: 6.7%
Mason Marchment: 3.7%
Jamie Benn: 4.1%
Matt Duchene: 4.5%
Evgenie Dadonov: 6.2%
That's five of the "deepest and most talented forward group in the NHL" who, combined, have scored 5 goals in a combined 75 games played. Five goals in a season's worth of games is what you get from your lumbering 3rd-pair DMan who gets 12 minutes of ice per night.
I believe Jim Nill, Pete deBoer and fans like myself should now be disabused of this "most talented" group because reality is they've been, at best, even in two of the series and you could argue the forwards have been outplayed in all 3.
And you have to wonder if this iteration of the Stars has simply gone as far as they can go. They've been non-competitive each of the last 3 years when they reached the rarified air of the final four in hockey.
This team doesn't seem big enough, fast enough, skilled enough and physical enough to play with the best in the NHL. THe complete and utter absence of any kind of physical response to Darnell Nurse hatcheting Roope says volumes about this team's unwillingness to get physical.
And when guys like Duchene and Robertson and Marchment and Benn pull Houdini-like disappearing acts when the games count most you have to wonder if there's a future here for them.
Speaking of Benn, he's contributed almost nothing positive throughout the playoffs and finally, at long last, looks like age has caught him. Much like Joe Pavelski last year, his game seems to be deteriorating before our eyes. I can't recall a single team that won the Stanley Cup without getting key contributions from their Captain. Frankly, I'd be disappointed if he's still the Captain when next season starts.
I know I sound doom and gloom and the reality is a game 4 victory returns home ice advantage to Dallas and things can change quickly. There's a non-zero chance of that happening and these words then looking stupid. But it's not much higher than zero.
The playoffs are a wild ride. They're at the lowest point they've been all postseason. We'll see how they respond in Game 4, because that will either give them a brand new series with home ice again, or practically end their run altogether.
The Stars have played a lot of stinkers on the road this playoff season. And they're still alive. They can even regain a slight upper hand if they win the next game. If not, it's probably over.
Thought the narrative could be different after Tuesday night, after 3 games it is clear the Oilers top 6 forwards are playing much better than the Stars top 6. To win, it's often said your best players need to play their best. That's not happening so far. And they need Hintz, period. The other guys aren't picking it up. Still not happy that Harley is not on the # 1 PP. He has offensive instincts that Miro does not.
They can't afford to even take 20 seconds or 1 minute off. They seem deflated after the non-call on delay of game, and in one minute, the entire period was wasted and game essentially over. I'm not sure why Pete did not challenge the non-call. I've researched, and unless I'm missing something, he could have challenged the call. Yes, if it is ruled against you, you give Edmonton a PP. But the video evidence seemed very clear on the broadcast and the announcers seemed to agree that Edmonton got away with this. Bob, to your knowledge, is this correct that the non-call could have been challenged? Nevertheless, you can't let your foot off the pedal.
Sure am praying for a win Tuesday. I don't see us winning 3 in a row. And I'm going to Dallas Thursday for Game 5, hoping it is 2-2. That changes the whole vibe in the building going in.
Hi Bob. To answer your question, coaches cannot challenge a missed delay of game penalty. The challenge they added was only for a penalty call that was made, to potentially take it away.
Thank you, Bob. That doesn't make sense, but that's the NHL and their rules. BTW, the Stars were 22-16 plus OT on the road in the regular season. But, in the 7 games thus far in the playoffs, they are 2-5 and look like a completely different team than at home. Not to mention almost always giving up the first goal, which means they are chasing 13 of the past 16 games. Pete has been getting testy with some of the questions lately. Has he been asked about this trend? Even with Roope, they are hard pressed to beat Edmonton 3 games in a row, so I pretty much feel Tuesday is a MUST win, or it's over.
My opinion is that even with Hintz, is that this team, though clearly a top team, with very good talent, is NOT able to compete with the big boys at the very top of the league.
Carolina is learning that lesson also.
Doesn’t mean they’re bad, they just are not good enough… but they are better than 30 other teams.
Physicality is missing.
Elite d is missing.
Junk yard dog fight level is missing.
Best performances under the biggest spotlight is missing Duchene-Robertson.
Aging players are not good enough anymore -Seguin-Benn.
Elite playmaking/passing is missing.
Nill the chemistry prof is going to have to get back to the lab!
I think the biggest problem is too many players who look like they have run out of gas. Age has something to do with it, but so does the injury situation that has forced a lot of other players to play a lot more minutes. It has caught up to them, it seems.
This was the kind of game than can positively make you hate hockey for a few hours. The Stars were clearly the better team in every way except the score throughout the first two periods and much of the third. Maybe the Oilers are the better overall team overall, but today was not a 6-1 game in any rational sense but the score (which ultimately is all that matters...I know, no need to remind me).
The good news is that the Stars get another crack at winning back home ice advantage. And if there is any one truth to playoff hockey, it is that it is always a mistake to assume that the next game will be like the last one. Momentum always dies at the end of any playoff hockey game. Just ask the Colorado Avalanche and Winnipeg Jets. You don't even have to outplay a team, just outscore them.
Michael Strawn's comments below pretty much nailed it. Bob, I know you said it's a different game, but I don't think we're talking about careless retribution. As PK Subban and Messier have noted during intermissions, the Stars are not making it hard on McDavid and Leon at all. Finish your checks. Cleanly. Every time. They are hardly hitting them at all. Maybe that's because they can't keep up with them, which is quite possible. Since the 2-0 lead on the road in Edmonton in Game 4 last year, it's like somebody flipped a switch, and the Stars have been in the dark room pretty much since. I'm certainly not writing them off, given their propensity to come back, but this is the first time they have lost 2 in row this playoff. Nothing is impossible in sports, but if they go down 3-1, I would put the odds at less than 5% they win 3 in a row. Hoping we don't face that, but if they do, one has to wonder what Jim Nill can do to ever put them over the hump. Just a week ago, all the rage was how Otter was playing better than Hellebuyck and should be the Team USA Olympic goalie, and now we're looking at 2 consecutive years of him being outplayed by Stuart Skinner?
I was disappointed in the Stars in general and the captain in particular that there were no hard hits on Darnell Nurse. No retribution whatsoever for his slash on Roope. Unbelievable.
It's a different game than it used to be, for sure. They're focused on winning, and chasing around a player and getting a major penalty for retaliation (and/or a suspension) isn't something they're looking to do, apparently.
Yeah, I didn't want to see them be distracted by Nurse. This was one of the good things about the game today.
Yes, Stars didn’t get the breaks, but as you say, they need to make their own breaks. Odd man rushes a function of pressing for offence when behind. I also wish Stars would have extracted ‘a bit’ of retribution for the Nurse infraction.
Yes, Oilers made the most of their chances, and that wins games. Deserved win for them, and a tough loss for Dallas.
It's pretty simple. Edmonton is better. And it's not disputable in any way.
They're bigger.
They're stronger.
They're faster.
They're more skilled.
They're more physical.
And, for the 2nd time in two years, they've received the better goaltending.
There's not a single area where Dallas hasn't been outplayed by a substantial margin.
Consider these numbers:
Since game 4 of the 2024 WCF Edmonton has won 5 of six games and outscored Dallas 21-11. That's an avg score of 3.5 to 1.8. The Stars have scored 1 or fewer goals in 4 of those six games. Pretty hard to win when you never score more than a goal.
Further, getting exposed in the WCF is just what this iteration of the Dallas Stars does. They've played 15 WCF Finals games since 2023; they are 5-10 in those games and have been outscored 48 to 35. And the numbers get worse the further you go into a series:
Game 1: Stars have outscored opponents 11-10 (Positive!)
Game: 2: Stars have been outscored 7-5
Game 3: Stars have outscored opponents 10-8
So games 1-3 Dallas is even at 26-26. However, from games 4 through 6 Dallas has been outscored 22-9.
Game 4: Stars outscored 7-5
Game 5: Stars outscored 7-3
Game 6: Stars outscored 8-1
I would argue that by game 5 of each of these series it was clearly established that Vegas and Edmonton had objectively better teams than the Stars.
And that feeling is moreso in 2025. Outside of those fluky 5 minutes when Edmonton lost their mind and took a trio of penalties the Stars have been outscored 12-1.
Literally no one is playing at the hoped for level. Huge parts of the roster have continued their highly disappointing post-season play. The biggest issue is no one can score. The Stars had an 11.8% goal percentage on shots on net in the regular season - a full 1.1 points higher than the league average. Consider the following players shooting pct in playoffs:
Jason Robertson: 6.7%
Mason Marchment: 3.7%
Jamie Benn: 4.1%
Matt Duchene: 4.5%
Evgenie Dadonov: 6.2%
That's five of the "deepest and most talented forward group in the NHL" who, combined, have scored 5 goals in a combined 75 games played. Five goals in a season's worth of games is what you get from your lumbering 3rd-pair DMan who gets 12 minutes of ice per night.
I believe Jim Nill, Pete deBoer and fans like myself should now be disabused of this "most talented" group because reality is they've been, at best, even in two of the series and you could argue the forwards have been outplayed in all 3.
And you have to wonder if this iteration of the Stars has simply gone as far as they can go. They've been non-competitive each of the last 3 years when they reached the rarified air of the final four in hockey.
This team doesn't seem big enough, fast enough, skilled enough and physical enough to play with the best in the NHL. THe complete and utter absence of any kind of physical response to Darnell Nurse hatcheting Roope says volumes about this team's unwillingness to get physical.
And when guys like Duchene and Robertson and Marchment and Benn pull Houdini-like disappearing acts when the games count most you have to wonder if there's a future here for them.
Speaking of Benn, he's contributed almost nothing positive throughout the playoffs and finally, at long last, looks like age has caught him. Much like Joe Pavelski last year, his game seems to be deteriorating before our eyes. I can't recall a single team that won the Stanley Cup without getting key contributions from their Captain. Frankly, I'd be disappointed if he's still the Captain when next season starts.
I know I sound doom and gloom and the reality is a game 4 victory returns home ice advantage to Dallas and things can change quickly. There's a non-zero chance of that happening and these words then looking stupid. But it's not much higher than zero.
Like I said to start...Edmonton's better.
The playoffs are a wild ride. They're at the lowest point they've been all postseason. We'll see how they respond in Game 4, because that will either give them a brand new series with home ice again, or practically end their run altogether.
The Stars have played a lot of stinkers on the road this playoff season. And they're still alive. They can even regain a slight upper hand if they win the next game. If not, it's probably over.
Thought the narrative could be different after Tuesday night, after 3 games it is clear the Oilers top 6 forwards are playing much better than the Stars top 6. To win, it's often said your best players need to play their best. That's not happening so far. And they need Hintz, period. The other guys aren't picking it up. Still not happy that Harley is not on the # 1 PP. He has offensive instincts that Miro does not.
They can't afford to even take 20 seconds or 1 minute off. They seem deflated after the non-call on delay of game, and in one minute, the entire period was wasted and game essentially over. I'm not sure why Pete did not challenge the non-call. I've researched, and unless I'm missing something, he could have challenged the call. Yes, if it is ruled against you, you give Edmonton a PP. But the video evidence seemed very clear on the broadcast and the announcers seemed to agree that Edmonton got away with this. Bob, to your knowledge, is this correct that the non-call could have been challenged? Nevertheless, you can't let your foot off the pedal.
Sure am praying for a win Tuesday. I don't see us winning 3 in a row. And I'm going to Dallas Thursday for Game 5, hoping it is 2-2. That changes the whole vibe in the building going in.
Hi Bob. To answer your question, coaches cannot challenge a missed delay of game penalty. The challenge they added was only for a penalty call that was made, to potentially take it away.
https://www.nhl.com/news/general-managers-vote-to-expand-coach-challenge
Thank you, Bob. That doesn't make sense, but that's the NHL and their rules. BTW, the Stars were 22-16 plus OT on the road in the regular season. But, in the 7 games thus far in the playoffs, they are 2-5 and look like a completely different team than at home. Not to mention almost always giving up the first goal, which means they are chasing 13 of the past 16 games. Pete has been getting testy with some of the questions lately. Has he been asked about this trend? Even with Roope, they are hard pressed to beat Edmonton 3 games in a row, so I pretty much feel Tuesday is a MUST win, or it's over.
My opinion is that even with Hintz, is that this team, though clearly a top team, with very good talent, is NOT able to compete with the big boys at the very top of the league.
Carolina is learning that lesson also.
Doesn’t mean they’re bad, they just are not good enough… but they are better than 30 other teams.
Physicality is missing.
Elite d is missing.
Junk yard dog fight level is missing.
Best performances under the biggest spotlight is missing Duchene-Robertson.
Aging players are not good enough anymore -Seguin-Benn.
Elite playmaking/passing is missing.
Nill the chemistry prof is going to have to get back to the lab!
I think the biggest problem is too many players who look like they have run out of gas. Age has something to do with it, but so does the injury situation that has forced a lot of other players to play a lot more minutes. It has caught up to them, it seems.
This pretty well sums it up.
This was the kind of game than can positively make you hate hockey for a few hours. The Stars were clearly the better team in every way except the score throughout the first two periods and much of the third. Maybe the Oilers are the better overall team overall, but today was not a 6-1 game in any rational sense but the score (which ultimately is all that matters...I know, no need to remind me).
The good news is that the Stars get another crack at winning back home ice advantage. And if there is any one truth to playoff hockey, it is that it is always a mistake to assume that the next game will be like the last one. Momentum always dies at the end of any playoff hockey game. Just ask the Colorado Avalanche and Winnipeg Jets. You don't even have to outplay a team, just outscore them.
Michael Strawn's comments below pretty much nailed it. Bob, I know you said it's a different game, but I don't think we're talking about careless retribution. As PK Subban and Messier have noted during intermissions, the Stars are not making it hard on McDavid and Leon at all. Finish your checks. Cleanly. Every time. They are hardly hitting them at all. Maybe that's because they can't keep up with them, which is quite possible. Since the 2-0 lead on the road in Edmonton in Game 4 last year, it's like somebody flipped a switch, and the Stars have been in the dark room pretty much since. I'm certainly not writing them off, given their propensity to come back, but this is the first time they have lost 2 in row this playoff. Nothing is impossible in sports, but if they go down 3-1, I would put the odds at less than 5% they win 3 in a row. Hoping we don't face that, but if they do, one has to wonder what Jim Nill can do to ever put them over the hump. Just a week ago, all the rage was how Otter was playing better than Hellebuyck and should be the Team USA Olympic goalie, and now we're looking at 2 consecutive years of him being outplayed by Stuart Skinner?